156cm question about wrist rotation

abracadabra · Post by **abracadabra** » Fri Dec 23, 2016 3:19 pm

OK first and foremost I want to emphasize that the copper wires in this picture are not the originals I repeat they are not the originals they have been lost for a long time these are similar get smaller in gauge size The Originals were a little bit thicker but still able to slide inside of the silver coil that you see in the palm of the hand they also had string wrapped around them as to potentially hold the tpe material and the copper wire into place is a guess

abracadabra · Post by **abracadabra** » Fri Dec 23, 2016 3:22 pm

The flat metal Junction where the silver coils all meet up is where the hand needs to be held when attempting to turn the wrist or forearm and it needs to be done extended straight out Not Bent

pmvlove · Post by **pmvlove** » Fri Dec 23, 2016 3:23 pm

Thank you so much for the detailed responses. I'll give it a try the next chance I get, which might be after Christmas at this point, but I really appreciate it, and will share some photos soon as well

LAL · Post by **LAL** » Fri Dec 23, 2016 3:32 pm

[quote="haremlover"]http://dollforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=143&t=61317 is the DS wrist rotation thread and it applies to many dolls with rotating wrists whilst http://dollforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=215&t=65867 is Pippa's guide to wrists.

Haremlover:
Just viewed Pippa's guide to wrists. EXCELLENT tutorial. Pippa is one of the most beautiful dolls I have seen on this forum and probably one of the smartest.

One question a bit off topic. I know there have been a lot of warnings about black/dark colors, but I have not seen anything mentioned about black leather/pu/pvc materials. I have some ideas for pictures and would make sure I have something nude or white underneath. And she would only be in the outfits just long enough for the pictures. Any experience on that issue would be appreciated.

Thanks

LAL · Post by **LAL** » Fri Dec 23, 2016 3:41 pm

abracadabra wrote:The flat metal Junction where the silver coils all meet up is where the hand needs to be held when attempting to turn the wrist or forearm and it needs to be done extended straight out Not Bent

abracadabra;

Great pictures; they really help in understanding what is going on. The doll companies have really done a great job in 2016 making their dolls even more beautiful. Hopefully they can work on improving the skeletons during 2017.

Do you have foot and neck area pictures?
Thanks so much for helping us newbies.

abracadabra · Post by **abracadabra** » Fri Dec 23, 2016 4:53 pm

LAL wrote:
abracadabra wrote:The flat metal Junction where the silver coils all meet up is where the hand needs to be held when attempting to turn the wrist or forearm and it needs to be done extended straight out Not Bent
abracadabra;

Great pictures; they really help in understanding what is going on. The doll companies have really done a great job in 2016 making their dolls even more beautiful. Hopefully they can work on improving the skeletons during 2017.

Do you have foot and neck area pictures?
Thanks so much for helping us newbies.

You are quite welcome the feat are more or less identical to the hands with the exception that the silver coil only goes to the big toe the others are left free I spoke with one of the manufacturers about the finger issue and proposed some potential Solutions and they are going to test some of those ideas out and get back with everybody as to how they might make some changes. the problem they have using bigger gauge copper is in the casting process there's not enough room to allow the fluid to make it to the tips of the fingers in the mold but there are alternatives to fix this issue they just need to be explored

abracadabra · Post by **abracadabra** » Fri Dec 23, 2016 4:57 pm

LAL wrote:
haremlover wrote:http://dollforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=143&t=61317 is the DS wrist rotation thread and it applies to many dolls with rotating wrists whilst http://dollforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=215&t=65867 is Pippa's guide to wrists.

Haremlover:
Just viewed Pippa's guide to wrists. EXCELLENT tutorial. Pippa is one of the most beautiful dolls I have seen on this forum and probably one of the smartest.

One question a bit off topic. I know there have been a lot of warnings about black/dark colors, but I have not seen anything mentioned about black leather/pu/pvc materials. I have some ideas for pictures and would make sure I have something nude or white underneath. And she would only be in the outfits just long enough for the pictures. Any experience on that issue would be appreciated.

Thanks

PVC and pleather or the liners that go inside of a leather jacket are all pretty safe to put on the skin tho I Warn you putting black suede leather on tpe doll as it will stain and it will stain quickly
I did a shoot last night with a leather collar that I made and I literally only kept it on long enough to shoot four or five pictures and then took it off and I could still see a fainte staining.

Dees Man · Post by **Dees Man** » Sat Dec 24, 2016 6:40 am

G'day everyone

When I checked in today I saw there's quite a few posts added here and it makes some interesting reading.

abracadabra wrote:The flat metal Junction where the silver coils all meet up is where the hand needs to be held when attempting to turn the wrist or forearm and it needs to be done extended straight out Not Bent

I had a look back at Harem's thread on WM hand movement and that's how he says to do it. I'm not saying either of you are wrong because that obviously has worked for you, but I was not able to move Ash's wrists this way without fear of damaging the soft TPE.

My other TPE has the old wired hands so my experience lies with the soft silicone DS now makes. There were members who were damaging the hands by using the same method you mention above which prompted jiayi to post this stickie http://www.dollforum.com/forum/viewtopi ... 43&t=61317

I realise it's a different manufacturer but the softness is similar and the mechanics is the same. By bending the wrist 90° (like in the DS stickie) it then acts like a lever and I can get a firm grip all around the plate so I don't concentrate the pressure on one point.

ILuvFemsNlingerie wrote:Ok I just tried doing what Dees Man mention on her right arm and couldn't get it to budge.
I don't want to damage her so I stopped, when I was trying to twist her forearm the "bone" didn't move but the TPE skin did

When I read this I saw how badly I explained my method and you misunderstood me.

My hand on the forearm only assists my other hand. Don't put force on the forearm if there is no movement from the other hand. It's really just holding the arm steady while trying to put so much force on a very stiff wrist.

Reading that last sentence I can see I'm having trouble being clear with words. I will make a short video shortly which would be much clearer. With it being Xmas eve right now I think you'll understand that may take a few days, sorry. Watch this space

DM

mike-fish · Post by **mike-fish** » Mon Dec 26, 2016 12:59 pm

My new 156 also has very stiff wrists and because it is my first doll I am not sure how to handle her. Now with the helpful advice here I will try again to move them.

Is the TPE moulded directly around the skeleton, touching it or are there gaps?

Is it true that because TPE absorbs oil then eventually some could reach the joints and loosen them slightly?

The pictures of the actual joints are fascinating to me from an engineering perspective - how did you get them and do you have a complete skeleton? If so I would love to see it.

Many thanks
Mike

itvman · Post by **itvman** » Mon Dec 26, 2016 9:35 pm

I was scared of moving the limbs but if you do it slowly and in a sensible way I can't see there'd be any problem. I haven't tried rotating her hands though, because I can't figure out if they are just stiff joints or don't actually rotate. I can just see myself trying to turn her hand and ripping it off! She can stay palms down for the moment until somebody from WM clarifies.

pmvlove · Post by **pmvlove** » Mon Dec 26, 2016 10:38 pm

I don't think I'll be trying to rotate the wrists any time soon. Just tonight I was only hinging the wrists up and down carefully, because her left hand was more stiff than the right, and it felt like something shifted under the tpe and all of a sudden her left fingers are floppy like the toes.

Only a few weeks and broken fingers from normal movement. I don't know if there's anyway to repair, without opening (which I won't do) so I'm not gonna risk ruining her right hand too. It sucks, because if I knew they were that fragile I wouldn't have even hinged the wrist up and down. Otherwise I still love her. I'm just upset because I loved her hands.

mike-fish · Post by **mike-fish** » Tue Dec 27, 2016 6:25 am

The wrists on my new WM 156 do move easily now although they were a bit stiff at first and moving the wrists gives so may more options to posing

abracadabra · Post by **abracadabra** » Tue Dec 27, 2016 9:27 am

mike-fish wrote:My new 156 also has very stiff wrists and because it is my first doll I am not sure how to handle her. Now with the helpful advice here I will try again to move them.

Is the TPE moulded directly around the skeleton, touching it or are there gaps?

Is it true that because TPE absorbs oil then eventually some could reach the joints and loosen them slightly?

The pictures of the actual joints are fascinating to me from an engineering perspective - how did you get them and do you have a complete skeleton? If so I would love to see it.

Many thanks
Mike

the joints are wrapped in in a cloth gauze and the hips , neck, wrist and feet have an extra layer of some mysterious heavier gauge material as well. string is used in some of the chest area around the breast.
my guess is this keeps the tpe from sliding off the skeleton.and tearing thru.

abracadabra · Post by **abracadabra** » Tue Dec 27, 2016 9:34 am

the joint nuts are all tack welded, so unless the weld breaks, which can happen, they are non adjustable, there's a variety of reasons the joint is stuck.
a weld may have gotten on part of the joint that inhibits the movement.
when welding , metal will try a twist when it's heated and cooled will sometimes twist a joint just enough so that it's difficult to move.
The string and gauzes that used below the material around the joints sometimes gets jammed up in the seams between the frame.

Dees Man · Post by **Dees Man** » Tue Dec 27, 2016 10:06 am

G'day all

With the weekend's festivities over and I was just trying to recover :drinking:

Ash stuck her hand up (literally) to do a quick video to show you how we rotate her wrists. I had looked at Harem's thread showing how to do this, but Ash's wrist's were so tight I was not willing to force it using the method he shows.

TDF member abracadabra has kindly allowed me to use his hand skeleton photo in the vid to help show what's going on inside her lovely hand.

DM