Buying head only from China. Customs to Europe?

[Torkan]

Thank you for lots of good advice, Harem.

I see that some of my post has been edited, and I apologize if I wrote something I shouldn't have.

[sture]

As for the Fedex vs DHL issue. I ordered another doll, a 100cm WM doll, in the beginning of December, and Fedex has had it with status "Clearance Delay" since mid December. I've contacted them several times and they say it's being processed by customs, which is weird, because customs say on the homepage that everything is handled by the courier company and not them. That they don't keep or store any packages.
I had no issues whatsoever with DHL. I hope this issue with Fedex is something that will be sorted out, and I would like to think that Fedex would let me know if they have no plans of delivering my doll, but who knows. It's been 6 weeks now and I still can't get any information from Fedex.

This is exactly how Fedex behaved towards me.
But...I contacted the Swedish Customs this monday, asking why my package still was in Clearance Delay...and guess what?
Suddenly Fedex text me yesterday and told me that I could pick up the package at the Airport. I asked them why I should pick it up when they have been payed
to deliver the package to my home (door to door service)? Then they informed me that the don´t deliver sexdolls because they are considered as pornographic content
and it is against Fedex policy!

You know, I believe the best thing would be if Vendors and manufacturers of dolls stopped using Fedex for delivery.
Fedex would of course loose money and perhaps it would lead to the point when they have to change their attitude and become more cooperative.

[haremlover]

I would press them. They have been paid to do the job. They can only object to do something if it's illegal.

Under EU Court Of Justice law sexdolls are not prohibited goods to be considered within the realms of pornography.

If the consignment was of women's dildos would they behave the same way? Of course not - it's sexual discrimination and capricious exercise of prejudice

Having been paid they are required by contract to deliver.

It would be in vendors' and manufacturers' interests to mount a group case against them.

When robots become big business will they refuse to deliver them also?

Best wishes

Harem

[sture]

The definition of pornography / obscene material has to accord with legislation.

That provision is in place for the purpose of protecting Fedex against being party to contravention of legislation relating to illegal items.

By reason of the European Court of Justice decision in the case of Conegate vs Customs and Excise 1986 rubber dolls were excluded from consideration as illegal items. "Pornographic" has to be construed in terms of "prohibited".

Rubber dolls are not prohibited and the numpty at Fedex responsible for their arbitrary opinion needs to be educated.

The summary of law is set out on http://dollforum.com/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 8#p1029858 Rubber dolls are as legal as plastic penises used by women. They are just larger.

This is the importance for members to build up a corpus of photographic work demonstrating that rubber dolls are not pornographic. That is particularly the pleasure with which I've seen this month's Photo Challenge winners which are possibly the furthest away I've seen from pornography at TDF. We need dolls to acquire a reputation of not being pornographic.

This is the very reason why DS have used the slogan on http://www.dsdoll.us/ "The high-end life size silicone sex dolls and photographic models" and perhaps we might encourage Sam at WM and other manufacturers to do likewise.

Dolls although capable of sex are capable of so much more.

If you would like to PM me with your email address I will send you a copy of the Chloé book to forward to Fedex in evidence that dolls are not pornographic. If you would like me to assist in levering them, I'll be happy to do so, although the time engaged on these battles is tedious and I've put other things aside to progress them. But it's a fight that needs to be engaged.

Torkan - please see http://dollforum.com/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 0#p1040380 You should get a seizure letter from Customs. That will give a phone number and a procedure to follow. Ideally under the Conegate case it's better to persuade them that their seizure is against the law set out by the European Court of Justice in 1986 and that the matter should need to go no further. If you can phone and ask for an email address that's great and I will be happy to help you. If they refuse to give an email address then refer to guidance given to Customs which does not prohibit sex dolls and which refers to common sense. It instructs that if in doubt officers should speak to their line manager. So if you have a refusal, ask to speak to the line manager. When you speak to the line manager, say that this is not specifically in relation to your doll but all dolls and that you want to be able to explain in writing to them how and why a mistake has been made so that everyone's time and misery is not repeated over and over again.

The photograph taken by Staycool64 on his 100cm doll For Sale thread is most helpful in demonstrating that the doll is a representation of an adult female and not a young girl and so not a matter which can help authorities track down anyone with xxxxxphilia in their minds. It demonstrates clearly that they're looking in the wrong place and exercising themselves uselessly.

Best wishes

Harem

It´s important to have the understanding that a Country´s Law and a Company´s private Policy, is two different things. Don´t mix it up.
As long as the policy don´t interfere with the law, it´s up to the company to follow their own private policy. Right or wrong you may think, it is what it is.
What the European Court of Justice once decided in the case of "Conegate vs Customs and Excise 1986" has no legal force within this matter!
This has nothing to do with Customs!
This is about a Company and their own private policy. A private policy based on ethics and values. Their ethics and values.

Like the ones we all have, although perhaps not the same...
But we are entitled to have them.
The same goes for a Company!
In this case: Fedex.

Having been paid they are required by contract to deliver.

It would be in vendors' and manufacturers' interests to mount a group case against them.

I totally agree with this. We should Contact all the vendors here and make them understand the importance of this!

Also, I feel that it might be up to the Vendor and not the client, to put some pressure on a delivery Company that doesn´t deliver...

Cheers

[haremlover]

Yes - you are quite right but pornography must have a definition. That definition for the purposes of international carriage, import and export, has to have some baseline against which to measure and the ECJ judgment provides that for this company working in this field within these countries.

Having got the consignment to the airport and been paid for the delivery they can't capriciously decide not to complete the delivery.

Furthermore, their policy has to be applied internationally rather than at the whim of some numpty in a local office operating to their own fancy. The policy in your local branch of interpreting the regulations in their particular way is not that applied in other branches. This becomes a matter for head office.

Is this a new doll from WM in China? If so this is for Sam or the vendor to take up seriously with Fedex at their end.

Please do PM me with email address so that I can send you material on email to press upon them.

I have emailed Sam with the following suggestions:
(1) making the sculpture of the head for the 100cm doll clearly adult.
for instance is amazing.
(2) shipping small dolls in clearly adult style clothes
(3) on websites make it clear that dolls are more than sexdolls and are amazing models for photography.

Best wishes

Harem

[symmes]

I contacted the Swedish Customs this monday, asking why my package still was in Clearance Delay...and guess what?
Suddenly Fedex text me yesterday and told me that I could pick up the package at the Airport. I asked them why I should pick it up when they have been payed
to deliver the package to my home (door to door service)? Then they informed me that the don´t deliver sexdolls because they are considered as pornographic content
and it is against Fedex policy!

Is that just in Europe, or worldwide? I received an OR Doll with a WM head on Monday, delivered by FedEx to my house in the USA, with no problems. That said, there were no signs that the box had been opened, so FedEx may not have known what was inside it. (The delivery guy commented on the weight and asked if it was a mattress. I said "something like that.")

If it really is FedEx policy to not delivery sex dolls, then I agree that another carrier should be used.

[Cloudclimax]

Hi All,

Just to stick in my twopenneth...

I have never had such issues with FedEx not delivering any items to wherever they have been sent to whatever they have been. However, FedEx is not a preferred carrier of Cloud Climax unless the shipment is going stateside.

We don't just deal in dolls, we sell all kinds of sexually orientated products including sex toys, machines etc and I have never been aware that FedEx have a policy that means they will not carry these products. My understanding has always been that no carrier will ship anything illegal or dangerous and they really were not much more fussy than that. I have never had an issue with FedEx.

I do agree that it would be the Vendors responsibility to contact Customs or Border Force on behalf of the customer in order to get the shipment released. This is the Cloud Climax policy and it always works a lot better than an individual contacting customs. That way if there is for example a paperwork issue it can be sorted out immediately, rather than the customer then having to contact the Vendor again etc and trying to explain that there is a problem that the Vendor needs to sort out. It saves the customer a whole lot of stress because most vendors should have experience in dealing with Customs and Border Force in several countries.

Buying any product should be made easy by the Vendor and they should take charge of any issue that arises whilst in transit and not wash their hands of it.

As an example, we have just last week had a shipment go to an European country that is no a part of the EU. It got stuck in Customs for 5 days. By putting pressure on the carrier and then onto Customs the doll was released. The issue was not down to the contents of the shipment. It was due to them requiring additional paperwork to the standard that is needed for international transit. As soon as this was provided it was released. Easily sorted out and everyone is a winner.

I think Customs issues can be a problem, but equally can be easily sorted out by a good Vendor who is both willing to help and knows the proper processes behind international shipping and Customs methods.

Thanks

Paul
Cloud Climax

[haremlover]

Another vendor commented to me without wanting the comment to be attached to him:

I do not want to leave trail and my thoughts as this could affect my business if some custom lark around and see that I call them stupid online.

Anyway, I think like some rogue custom agent, who impose either their belief or opinion, rather than follow the law, there can also be some rogue FedEx agent.

The last time I ship to Sweden was 2-3 months ago without issue. If it was FedEx policy then it would happen a lot right now but it isn't, so I think this is more of an isolated incident.

However, because FedEx is cheaper, thus more doll is shipped via FedEx, more likely chances of something happen to occur like this is not suprising. If DHL or UPS ship more of the doll, I'm sure we'll see more problem from them as well.

Obviously, we do not have the statistic, but from my own shipping alone 75-80% are shipped with FedEx so as you can see I will likely have more issue with FedEx than DHL/UPS.

Best wishes

Harem

[DreamyDollGirl]

I would press them. They have been paid to do the job. They can only object to do something if it's illegal.

Under EU Court Of Justice law sexdolls are not prohibited goods to be considered within the realms of pornography.

If the consignment was of women's dildos would they behave the same way? Of course not - it's sexual discrimination and capricious exercise of prejudice

Having been paid they are required by contract to deliver.

It would be in vendors' and manufacturers' interests to mount a group case against them.

When robots become big business will they refuse to deliver them also?

Best wishes

Harem

I don't understand why pornographic material is prohibited in the first place? As long as it is not clearly nonconsential porn should be fine to make, buy and own? I was not aware this is illegal in the EU and I am very suprised. And what you say about dildos is so true, it is discrimination based on what kind of sex toy you prefere. Such a mad world se live in

[Pyewacket]

Off topic but ive a light skinned #36.. good choice!
All the sisters come out a little different after make up/wig..so we ar'nt too jealous.
Omg she is So very beautiful sometimes.. i sure hope you can get the body to match sooner than later.

no photo can do her justice..she's prettier than any picture you'll see

[sture]

I would press them. They have been paid to do the job. They can only object to do something if it's illegal.

Under EU Court Of Justice law sexdolls are not prohibited goods to be considered within the realms of pornography.

If the consignment was of women's dildos would they behave the same way? Of course not - it's sexual discrimination and capricious exercise of prejudice

Having been paid they are required by contract to deliver.

It would be in vendors' and manufacturers' interests to mount a group case against them.

When robots become big business will they refuse to deliver them also?

Best wishes

Harem

I don't understand why pornographic material is prohibited in the first place? As long as it is not clearly nonconsential porn should be fine to make, buy and own? I was not aware this is illegal in the EU and I am very suprised. And what you say about dildos is so true, it is discrimination based on what kind of sex toy you prefere. Such a mad world se live in

DreamyDollGirl ,

Porn is not prohibited in EU per se, but there are countries within EU that doesn´t allow selling, buying or importing porn (Sweden is of course not one of them)!
Here´s a link to the subject: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pornography_by_region
and another one (it needs an update htough, Sweden doesn´t allow animal porn any more): http://self.gutenberg.org/articles/list ... by_country

[DreamyDollGirl]

Just wanted to update if anyone is interested. I got my head now! Ordered via DollsFrance and she arrived today. I got no additional cost whatsoever, and everything went smooth so I am very satisfied. And, ofcorse I'm in love even more. Now just saving up for her body

[DreamyDollGirl]

Another update: Turns out I have to pay customs 238 SEK that is 25 Euro. Not too bad anyway.

[titjob]

Another update: Turns out I have to pay customs 238 SEK that is 25 Euro. Not too bad anyway.

Why pay tax from france to sweden in EU?

[DreamyDollGirl]

Another update: Turns out I have to pay customs 238 SEK that is 25 Euro. Not too bad anyway.

Why pay tax from france to sweden in EU?

The package came from Singapore.