Statement on price matching policies
- Dollstudio
- VENDOR
- Posts: 6554
- Joined: Thu Nov 06, 2014 6:21 pm
- Location: Berlin
- Contact:
Statement on price matching policies
most manufacturers have recently introduced minimum retail prices. This was a response to a development which started a couple of months ago - factory gate prices dropped below thresholds that were no longer sustainable, neither for manufacturers nor for vendors. If manufacturing dolls is not even profitable for manufacturers anymore, quality decreases and innovation stagnates. When manufacturers were asked to sell at less than cost prices, some of them hit the brakes. They were not willing to sacrifice product quality by cutting down costs for materials, labour and quality even control further.
To keep the doll business sustainable, some vendors complied with minimum retail price requirements; others started exactly the opposite and announced extremely aggressive "best price" and/or "price matching policies".
Price matching is harmful for everybody involved; it devalues the products; and by definition, it necessarily violates any minimum retail pricing agreements. Last but not least, it triggers the development to sell at less than cost prices which is extremely destructive if practised on a large scale.
Price matching destroys any attempt to keep the doll market sustainable. It is a race to the bottom where nobody can win.
At Dollstudio, we want to calculate fair prices for customers, but leaving a reasonable margin as well for the manufacturer as for us. We do not force manufacturers to decrease gate prices, requiring them to cut down on costs for materials, labour and quality control. We want to sell good dolls, and we want to continue to be able to provide pre-sales and after-sales service.
I think there is nothing wrong with limited time promotions and competitive pricing. But a general and permanent "price matching policy" is short-sighted and harmful. A customer can check prices on vendor "A" website, then ask vendor "B" for price matching, then go to vendor "C" and ask for another price matching round with the offer from vendor "B". Then he can go back to vendor "B" and ask for price matching with the offer from vendor "C", and so on. With this, pricing will quickly drop below cost level and be no longer sustainable.
Vendors who actively participate in price matching are destroying the doll business. We do not want to take part in this.
Based on data from our website access and sales stats, the primary usage for the Dollstudio websites is to obtain reference pricing for purchases elsewhere. To put an end to this, large parts of the websites are now access restriced.
Sandro
Dollstudio US - Customers from the U.S., Canada and outside the EU, please visit us.dollstudio.org (in English)
Dollstudio DE - Kunden aus Deutschland sind willkommen auf de.dollstudio.org (in Deutsch)
Get news & updates on Twitter - Dollstudio @Twitter
DS Doll Europe (EU) - Customers from EU countries, please visit en.dsdolleurope.com (in English)
Dollstudio Dollworks Adapter System - Create your hybrid doll!
- haremlover
- Doll Visionary
- Posts: 16238
- Joined: Tue May 26, 2009 12:00 am
- Location: UK and South of France
- Contact:
Re: Photos with OR-160/H and OR-032 head (#147)
I answered this before but my response was uncomfortable and based upon what I know goes on in China but am unable to quote sources and so was removed.
The question remains above "is the price too low or too high?"
Your price is too low and close to the bone for vendors and manufacturers for quality of product and quality of service not to be eroded, whatever you might have negotiated. In China there is a spiral of Chinese agents who are armtwisting (negotiating) manufacturers to give ever lower prices and one only needs half an eye to be able to see that that will erode manufacturers' abilities to provide quality control, quality at all, and willingness to send a replacement when things are obviously wrong. I'm having exactly that experience on behalf of a TDF member having received an obviously faulty doll from a non TDF approved vendor, and had another experience early this year in relation to another non-TDF vendor who had forced prices close to the bone he couldn't afford to send a replacement when things went wrong. That is my direct experience of the spiral which you are leading here.
You only have to look at the For Sale part of this forum to see many people having bought a doll and for some reason or other want to get rid of her. Decided dolls not for them, or new real people coming into their lives, or fears of spouses finding a doll. If you look at the prices it's entirely reasonable for people to want to recoup as much of their purchase as they can. Knocking out new dolls at unsustainable prices undercuts the second hand market. That's short sighted as if people know that they're going to lose hand over fist with no second hand value, they will be more reluctant to buy a doll because they can't sell them. The result will be less dolls sold so ultimately vendors and manufacturers in a price dumping market lose out.
Management removed my previous response which included more detail of the clear commonsense of this issue but in my opinion this is a matter of commonsense and one upon which discussion is needed, if only to point out the obvious, blindingly obvious indeed.
Best wishes
Harem
Reason: Moved from another thread
Chloé's book
is available from The-Doll-House
- - - -
Here's Coverdoll Yolanda
- - - -
Reviews for:
-DS-OR-JY-SY-Jarliet-Vivid-SM-SE-ZOne-JM-Sino-Sanhui-Pipedream--XY-WM-Elsa Babe-SM Silicone Siliko-XYcolo-Starpery-Elsa Babe-FutureDoll-Zelex-Irontech-FJ Doll
- - - -
YouTube Doll Review Channel
-https://www.youtube.com/@sexdoll-reviews-
Re: Photos with OR-160/H and OR-032 head (#147)
On the other hand. Those with less money can afford to buy new and risk less. The result would be more dolls sold.
- haremlover
- Doll Visionary
- Posts: 16238
- Joined: Tue May 26, 2009 12:00 am
- Location: UK and South of France
- Contact:
Re: Photos with OR-160/H and OR-032 head (#147)
Hmm. I understand your idea but that's actually the consumer waste society that we need to move away from if the human race is to survive. If dolls are not capable of being sold second hand, although their materials are supposed to be recyclable and certainly TPE makes good moulding material for decorative plasterwork, we read frequently of people just cutting them up and putting them in the dumpster.sdl44 wrote:Hi H
On the other hand. Those with less money can afford to buy new and risk less. The result would be more dolls sold.
With energy of materials manufacture and materials consumed, together with energy involved in air transport across the world from China, considering the doll business as a trade of disposable commodities is not environmentally sustainable.
The second hand market of any product is an important part of its life-cycle and those who don't consider that are stuck in the 20th century. The human race has to move on to longer term considerations.
Best wishes
Harem
Chloé's book
is available from The-Doll-House
- - - -
Here's Coverdoll Yolanda
- - - -
Reviews for:
-DS-OR-JY-SY-Jarliet-Vivid-SM-SE-ZOne-JM-Sino-Sanhui-Pipedream--XY-WM-Elsa Babe-SM Silicone Siliko-XYcolo-Starpery-Elsa Babe-FutureDoll-Zelex-Irontech-FJ Doll
- - - -
YouTube Doll Review Channel
-https://www.youtube.com/@sexdoll-reviews-
- sigmeister
- Active Poster
- Posts: 99
- Joined: Sun Dec 08, 2013 5:54 am
- Location: Sydney Australia
- Contact:
Re: Photos with OR-160/H and OR-032 head (#147)
Also comes down to fairness and equity - there needs to be something in it for everyone inc the next person down the chain . . . . . .
sigmeister
Re: Statement on price matching policies
Price matching is a commonly used strategy in any market. It's annoying but something I fear no market will ever get rid of. I struggle with this exact thing in my business too, and if I turned down every sale because someone else matched my price I would be out of business. In a market overflowing with resellers of the same product it is bound to result in a few disappearing, it's a normal market adjustment. Sadly I fear the ones offering extra service and knowledge will be hardest hit at first. Unless resellers find something uniquely theirs it will be hard to compete with others. After the market adjusts I hope the ones offering more value than just the low price of the doll will come out on top, based on user reviews etc.
- Nescio50
- Site Manager - CoverDoll
- Posts: 23454
- Joined: Fri Jan 14, 2011 11:06 am
- Location: In TLC, The Low Countries, surrounded by dolls
- Contact:
Re: Statement on price matching policies
It's not just the sellers, it seems to me that quite some buyers opt for the lowest price, they bother about quality and services only after their doll is broken
Re: Statement on price matching policies
Really? There are many general store chains here that have boldy exclaimed to match and undercut their competitors prices if you prove them that you can get the item cheaper in another store. I'm in EU. No-one has done anything about it and I've often used that to get a discount.Nescio50 wrote:Price matching is illegal in the EU and US and probably most countries. Also price dumping is illegal although I don't think any government will bother about price dumping of love dolls, no jobs involved, this isn't steel
It's not just the sellers, it seems to me that quite some buyers opt for the lowest price, they bother about quality and services only after their doll is broken
Also in music stores, mentioning Thomanns prices will reward you with murderous glares but also heavy discounts afterwards.
http://dullahanprojects.com/plaisonar/
Works with all HTML5-compatible phones. Just press the pink button and shake your phone!
App Discussion: http://dollforum.com/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 7&start=45
- Nescio50
- Site Manager - CoverDoll
- Posts: 23454
- Joined: Fri Jan 14, 2011 11:06 am
- Location: In TLC, The Low Countries, surrounded by dolls
- Contact:
Re: Statement on price matching policies
That's not price fixing, a 'lowest price guarantee' is allowed. A group of sellers who make an agreement on pricing (to prevent competition) that's illegal. Fines are huge, in 2016 $4.1bn in EU alonedullahan wrote:There are many general store chains here that have boldy exclaimed to match and undercut their competitors prices if you prove them that you can get the item cheaper in another store. I'm in EU. No-one has done anything about it and I've often used that to get a discount.
Re: Statement on price matching policies
Ah, so there's a distinction like that. Some vendors here have been doing "lowest pice guarantee here", which I thought was he reason for this discussion. The latter sounds a cartel.Nescio50 wrote:That's not price fixing, a 'lowest price guarantee' is allowed. A group of sellers who make an agreement on pricing (to prevent competition) that's illegal. Fines are huge, in 2016 $4.1bn in EU alonedullahan wrote:There are many general store chains here that have boldy exclaimed to match and undercut their competitors prices if you prove them that you can get the item cheaper in another store. I'm in EU. No-one has done anything about it and I've often used that to get a discount.
http://dullahanprojects.com/plaisonar/
Works with all HTML5-compatible phones. Just press the pink button and shake your phone!
App Discussion: http://dollforum.com/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 7&start=45
Re: Statement on price matching policies
Then check prices on WM website, they are always higher then approved vendors. Example 157 b $2100 on WM website and I have a price of under $1700 thru an approved vendor
- haremlover
- Doll Visionary
- Posts: 16238
- Joined: Tue May 26, 2009 12:00 am
- Location: UK and South of France
- Contact:
Re: Statement on price matching policies
And therein is a problem. I know sellers who give special care to their customers and put desire to fund service above desire to cut price. The vendor through whom I bought my first solid doll I count as a friend and he refused to enter price cutting wars and is no longer selling dolls. His service was valuable to the doll community and his disappearance is a loss. When a vendor or manufacturer fails, it ends up that the doll community often help to pick up the pieces.mandos wrote:After the market adjusts I hope the ones offering more value than just the low price of the doll will come out on top, based on user reviews etc.
In negotiating on behalf of members with faulty vendors and manufacturers I've seen the sharp end of the lack of care that price warring brings.
I know dolls which whenever I pick them up to do a shoot work for me, every joint working to precision properly adjusted. I know specific manufacturers who care about their ladies and don't leave a customer in the lurch with a faulty one in any way.
If I enthuse about dolls or their vendors, it's for those reasons, and when I do, and when I complain about practices that I don't feel are to enthusiast's interests, I'm threatened with a handful of rule violations about cross posting, spamming and disruptive behaviour. But the reality is that it's one vendor progressively undercutting the next and the next that's the real disruptive behaviour. It disrupts the abilities of conscientious manufacturers and conscientious vendors to give the top quality products and services which purchase of expensive goods justifies.
Sitting back and not saying anything and not taking issue as a matter of duty means a lot of distress to many people as market forces are left to signal sources of higher quality. Waiting for market adjustment creates many casualties along the way.
Best wishes
Harem
- Nescio50
- Site Manager - CoverDoll
- Posts: 23454
- Joined: Fri Jan 14, 2011 11:06 am
- Location: In TLC, The Low Countries, surrounded by dolls
- Contact:
Re: Statement on price matching policies
Sure the latter is a cartel. But also manufacturers have to be careful. A manufacturer is allowed to announce a 'recommended retail price', but they are not allowed to enforce such a retail price. I guess that is what the OP is about, a manufacturer setting a minimum retail price.dullahan wrote:Ah, so there's a distinction like that. Some vendors here have been doing "lowest pice guarantee here", which I thought was he reason for this discussion. The latter sounds a cartel.
Re: Statement on price matching policies
Stabilizing the end buyer price with set retail prices is tricky in a global market. But, some manufacturers with excellent product loyalty and demand have a unilateral pricing policy that strictly dictates the retail price of their product. Good examples are Apple, Bose and Weber (grills). This would work for quality dolls, but the manufacturer would need to do it right to avoid getting undercut by comparable competition.
Re: Statement on price matching policies
Nescio50 wrote:Price matching is illegal in the EU and US and probably most countries.
I'm guessing you mean price fixing/cartel in both the statements above? I understand price matching as being the same as lowest price guaranteed. The EU has been fierce lately, I wonder who is next on EUs list.Nescio50 wrote:That's not price fixing, a 'lowest price guarantee' is allowed.
Are you sure? Try selling a Rolex/Breitling/Tag Heuer wrist watch below recommended retail price. They will physically show up on your doorstep (if you are a retailer) and tell you to stop it right now or they withdraw all their products from your store and blacklist you. Same with Nikon/Canon optics and all Apple products. Not saying a doll manufacturer should do this, but they could atleast get it in their agreements with the resellers in an attempt to counter the price dumping.Nescio50 wrote: A manufacturer is allowed to announce a 'recommended retail price', but they are not allowed to enforce such a retail price.