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 Post subject: Re: Finger wire repair
PostPosted: Wed Sep 13, 2017 8:49 pm 
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I admit I don't really understand the sub-boards here, so I am going to post this and reference it in the other board as well.

Through a total and frustrating hash-up I managed to delete all the pictures I took of my hand repair on Cinnamon today. Fortunately ( ? ) I have more fingers to repair and will take pictures of those operations depending on the outcome of this one.

I shall attempt to describe clearly:

First, Cinnamon is a WM170 M-cup TPE doll. Like others in these threads, she has a short, hollow palm plate filled with cement. Thumb and pinkie fingers are apparently attached through the side of the plate (more to come as I work on her thumbs) and the three middle fingers are attached through the end of the plate. In Cinnamon's case, the copper wire has parted right at or near the palm plate for both thumbs and all six "middle" fingers. Both pinkies remain attached and functional as of this post.

1) Today I opened her palm along the line of the palm plate. There was much crystallized cement to clear away.

2) I had been sent a video (not sure how to share, it may be too big to post) from WM through Sexy Real Sex Dolls that showed how they remove finger wires. You basically hold the broken/torn end of the copper wire with pliers and pull as if turning the finger inside out, then forcefully smooth the TPE away from the wire and surrounding thread. At first it doesn't look or feel like it is going to work, but eventually it worked just like in their video. The finger was nearly pulled inside-out but it popped back into place easily with a little encouragement. VERY floppy without its copper wire.

3) Using a drill I dug into the opening into the palm plate, then used needle-nose and regular pliers to pull the crud and stubs of copper wire out of the palm plate. I used pieces of tape to capture the small residue, cleaning the inside of her hand as well as I could.

4) Once the palm plate was emptied of all three stubs and the inside of her hand was as clean as I could reasonably get it, I inserted cut-to-size lengths of 12-gauge, insulated, stranded copper electrical cable into her fingers. It went in very smoothly, no Vaseline required. I chose 12-gauge based on tests at Lowes (I could not find the rubber twist ties, so I could not test their resistance and feel). The 12 gauge seemed best for the kind of resistance and pose-ability I was looking for. I almost went with 10, but it was harder to find. 14 was a little too soft. I chose insulated because first of all that's all there was, but second I like the insulation as an additional strengthening agent for the copper within, and I figured it would protect the TPE in case the stranded wires ... parted. (see how I avoid the break/snap/tear argument? But then I just brought it up. Sheesh. Stupid) I chose stranded over solid because I felt the copper would last longer, and the possibility is that even if one of the strands parts, its fellows will remain intact and continue to lend strength and duration before I have to do this all over again.

5) I sized all three fingers by putting the "stems" into the palm plate and making sure they would go in far enough. I had to do some trimming because the fingers looked too long, and I am still concerned the wires may be too long and may have finger pokes, but at this point I'm becoming more confident with repairs and pokes will be easy after this. Hopefully they won't happen anyway.

6) I am sure most epoxies would be up to this job, but someone specifically mentioned a brand called Araldite and as I was about to go to L3fty's meet-up and was feeling Amazon-lazy, I simply ordered some online. I mixed and applied using the provided paddle. I'd actually removed the middle finger stem to make it easier to get enough epoxy into the palm plate, and once it was full, re-inserted the middle stem. The instructions mentioned holding everything for 5-10 minutes so I got everyone as comfortable as they could be, positioned as naturally as I could, and held all together with my right hand. Browsed Pinterest with my left hand, on my phone. Killing time. Cool castles, a few Millenium Falcon pics, a dark elf or two, and an avocado recipe later, 10 minutes had evaporated. All seemed to be holding well, in fact the epoxy appears to have sealed the palm incision too, though it is not "soft" so I may have to trim it away and re-seal the wound. We'll see.

7) An overnight cure is desired (the long cure was something like 10 hours so that is going to be overnight). I will give an update tomorrow, including some "after" pictures (still kicking myself for the "before and during" pics, but I do have another hand and two thumbs to go) and if all goes well, this will be my new recommended fix for fingers.

I believe with this solution her fingers will not be as sturdy as before (she couldn't hold much anyway) but will return to pose-ability and look way more natural instead of floppy.

On a scale of 1-10 "doll repair complexity" I honestly give this only a 5 or so, right down the middle. This is certainly not beginner, but I am absolutely no expert. On the other hand it does require cutting TPE, removing skeleton pieces, drilling out a cavity, replacing skeleton pieces, gluing everything into place, and sealing a TPE wound, so perhaps it's more than a 5. Someone who does more repairs will have to better calibrate my ... calibration.



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 Post subject: Re: Finger wire repair
PostPosted: Wed Sep 13, 2017 10:20 pm 
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I would be interested in seeing the video even though Holly is a 6ye doll. The broken finger, both thumbs and one wrist all happened within the first two weeks and no more damage since. By using a flashlight as an x-ray machine I can tell the finger is broken where it joins the hand. The TPE on the palms where the thumbs attach is too thick for the light I'm using to tell what's going on. I wonder how similar the construction is between manufacturers?



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 Post subject: Re: Finger wire repair
PostPosted: Thu Sep 14, 2017 3:11 pm 
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I am attempting to secure permission to share this video. If they say yes, I will put it in a private channel on YouTube and provide the link in this thread.



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 Post subject: Re: Finger wire repair
PostPosted: Fri Sep 15, 2017 12:49 am 
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4) Once the palm plate was emptied of all three stubs and the inside of her hand was as clean as I could reasonably get it, I inserted cut-to-size lengths of 12-gauge, insulated, stranded copper electrical cable into her fingers. It went in very smoothly, no Vaseline required. I chose 12-gauge based on tests at Lowes (I could not find the rubber twist ties, so I could not test their resistance and feel). The 12 gauge seemed best for the kind of resistance and pose-ability I was looking for.

This looks good and I like the idea of the stranded wire with the insulation. The twist ties may be Home Depot specific and they do have end caps that may help on the finger poke problem. However, you have a valid concern re the flexible coating compatibility. I'll do a comparison of these two options before I start my repairs. Looking forward to the videos.


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 Post subject: Re: Finger wire repair
PostPosted: Fri Sep 15, 2017 5:32 pm 
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Here is a link to my repair, includes pictures and a link to the WM video through SRSD's website:

http://www.dollforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=90101



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 Post subject: Re: Finger wire repair
PostPosted: Sat Sep 16, 2017 4:36 am 
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Just reviewed the video How to Fix Fingers in a TPE Sex Doll on SRSD's website. Seems not that easy to remove the wires from the fingers, they bond very well on the TPE.
Just a note: the 'test finger' I showed you viewtopic.php?p=1148138#p1148138 finally broke after some more bendings. Galvanized wire :thumbs_down: .
The idea for using stranded 12 gauge isolated copper wire sounds interesting, time to make a new 'test finger' stand.
Amazing skills and repair jobs are shown on this helpful topic, thanks for sharing all that :thumbs_up:

- SF -



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 Post subject: Re: Finger wire repair
PostPosted: Sat Sep 16, 2017 10:43 am 
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siliconefun wrote:
Just reviewed the video How to Fix Fingers in a TPE Sex Doll on SRSD's website. Seems not that easy to remove the wires from the fingers, they bond very well on the TPE.
Just a note: the 'test finger' I showed you viewtopic.php?p=1148138#p1148138 finally broke after some more bendings. Galvanized wire :thumbs_down: .
The idea for using stranded 12 gauge isolated copper wire sounds interesting, time to make a new 'test finger' stand.
Amazing skills and repair jobs are shown on this helpful topic, thanks for sharing all that :thumbs_up:

- SF -


Yes! You are right, you have to work at removing the existing wire/thread combo. The TPE does cling to it, but if you sort of repeat a "spreading/smoothing" motion it becomes more about holding the end of the wire firmly in a pair of pliers. You also have to be willing to let the finger pull nearly inside-out. I found that each time, about one "knuckle" was left outside and it was very easy to poke the finger back into place, but the first time you do it, it can make you feel uneasy.

Thanks siliconefun, I appreciate your feedback. Say - do you have broken fingers on a silicone doll? I was just asking in the other thread about this, what is the skeleton like inside the silicone hands?



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 Post subject: Re: Finger wire repair
PostPosted: Sat Sep 16, 2017 12:43 pm 
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CinnamonLover wrote:
Yes! You are right, you have to work at removing the existing wire/thread combo. The TPE does cling to it, but if you sort of repeat a "spreading/smoothing" motion it becomes more about holding the end of the wire firmly in a pair of pliers. You also have to be willing to let the finger pull nearly inside-out. I found that each time, about one "knuckle" was left outside and it was very easy to poke the finger back into place, but the first time you do it, it can make you feel uneasy.

Thanks siliconefun, I appreciate your feedback. Say - do you have broken fingers on a silicone doll? I was just asking in the other thread about this, what is the skeleton like inside the silicone hands?

CinnamonLover, actually none of my silicone dolls have broken fingers after a lot of careful bending but the design of the hands isn't that perfect.
On both RealDolls the finger wires are still okay but they've very sturdy AWG 16 steel wires inside (hope it's right) + aluminum end caps. For my taste a bit too sturdy to move.
Attachment:
11.jpg
11.jpg [ 78.54 KiB | Viewed 105 times ]

On my 4woods/Doll Story doll I noticed a flat steel wire with phalanges made of aluminum tube + plastic end caps. Just fine but prone for breaking.
Attachment:
Mia's finger construction.jpg
Mia's finger construction.jpg [ 289.74 KiB | Viewed 105 times ]

All this works fine but it could be done in a much better ways.

- SF -



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 Post subject: Re: Finger wire repair
PostPosted: Sat Sep 16, 2017 2:38 pm 
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WOW! Thanks for the awesome information. Dang. Those are very informative pictures and some great research.



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