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Inflata companies listen to us

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rubb3rl0v3r
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Re: Inflata companies listen to us

Post by rubb3rl0v3r »

DollWhisperer wrote:Bean-counters have been the ruin of many a product/market IMHO. Perhaps the same is true here, and that poor/sagging sales volume is actually due to the lack of availibility of what we really want rather than the other way around as is seen by the accountants. I, for one, totally believe there is a viable market out here for higher-quality $500-1000 airgirls, despite the economy. Are you listening, inflata companies???

DW
Are the vast majority of the inflata companies even based in the English speaking world? I am guessing thats why theres a lack of communication between manufacturers and the market.

For me, the problem isnt just about quality (although that is a big issue) as much as variety.

I agree with the sentiment that the porn star theme is a big turn off. Blonde hair, model like proportions, caucasian skin and blue eyes gets boring after a while. There are far too few ethnic beauties, fat babes or niche dolls like aliens, transparent dolls, or transexuals.

What i really want is a doll that isnt butt ugly that can give an automated handjob...surely this is technologically accomplishable?

!Damien*<
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Re: Inflata companies listen to us

Post by !Damien*< »

I wrote this a few years ago waiting for a thread like this to come up. I am aware that some of the dolls I mention here are discontinued and that RealDoll now has some competition.

I have a doll challenge for you.

Most of the doll news has been focusing on the Realdoll, an intimate, posable mannequin using a silicon mold on a steel skeleton. While realistic, they have three major drawbacks. First is weight: 60-100 lbs. Second is storage: they don't collapse neatly into a box. Third is the obvious outlay: $5-7K.

The first issue I want to address is materials. Vinyl is cheap and easy but weak. Latex is better but more suited for paint than dolls. I think you could take a page from the whitewater raft industry and look for materials they use. I found this at http://www.isu.edu/outdoor/raftequp.htm:

"Materials. Inflatable rafts are constructed of a stronger tear-resistant base fabric made of such materials as nylon, Dacron, or Kevlar. To provide resistance to abrasion, the fabric is coated with a synthetic material such as neoprene, Hypalon, neoprene-Hypalon blends, or polyvinyl chloride (PVC). It is difficult for the consumer to tell the difference in the quality of the materials used in the construction of boats since a wide variety of manufacturing processes and qualities of fabric and coating are used Generally, price is the best guide--the more expensive the boat, the better the materials used--although a few exceptions exist, such as when a manufacturer sells directly to customers, avoiding middlemen. First learn from friends what works best for them and buy from reputable companies."

I'd like to see at least a test of an inflatable doll made from neoprene-coated Kevlar.

I've seen a few attempts at posable inflatables. Alexa's Essential Elements and Gina Lynn are limited to arm movement. Winnie Wiggle moves both her arms and legs, but is otherwise mediocre. What I want to see, that no one has tried to my knowledge, is a modular inflatable made of several shaped sections connected by posable joints. The benefits:

1. Simplified design. Most inflatable dolls, especially the deluxe versions, require special forming and design that inevitably lowers effective yields. If you don't have to build the entire shape into one balloon you can save a lot on materials.
2. Flexibility. The more sections you can divide a doll into, the closer you can get to the build-to-order model of Real Doll. This can be done to extremes (knuckles) at the high end.
3. Strength*. Dividing a doll into sections removes the need for many of the seams that cause most failures. Theoretically, dividing a man’s weight more or less evenly on three balloons should make the load more bearable. The review of Letha Weapons indicates that this strategy has real potential.
4. Versatility. Doc Johnson's "Dream Girl" series has four dolls, one for each primary pose. Now think of one doll filling all four roles and many more.
5. Maintenance. Customers have the option of replacing or upgrading sections instead of entire dolls.

Now, how to make the joints? Use a large ball socket for multiple-axis joints (shoulders, hips, neck, wrists). Each joint piece is made in two parts that are glued on each side of the balloon. You can employ a male and female design or a double ball (three parts: female sockets in the two balloons to be joined and a male-male double ball connecting them). Silicone is best but any reasonably strong plastic/rubber combination that does not risk discomfort to the user is acceptable. For increased mobility I recommend the double ball.

For single-axis joints (elbows, knees, ankles, knuckles on fingers and toes) just use two smaller ball joints at opposing ends. One of the balloons will form two outer “fingers” of the joint and the other will form the narrow inner joint. Male/female joints are needed with the male joints on the outer fingers.

The only drawback I see is multiple inflation points, which can be ameliorated with check valves and a small straw-like tool for deflation.

The entry sleeves can be fixed in place using a modified version of the female joint socket with the inner end open. The socket pieces glue onto each side of the sleeve, which should be made in one piece. The exterior socket section can be molded to taste. This will add a lot of strength to what would otherwise be the most vulnerable areas.

A no-frills version (basic head, hands, and feet, no extras) should run about $100. A deluxe version (articulated hands, feet, fingers, and toes, mannequin head, optional vibrator/pump/perfume) should cost $500. The idea is to get as close to the quality and durability of the solid dolls as possible using inflatable, stowable materials.

Are you up to the challenge?

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Re: Inflata companies listen to us

Post by Mad Scientist »

!Damien*< wrote: I'd like to see at least a test of an inflatable doll made from neoprene-coated Kevlar.
Neoprene-coated Kevlar is overkill and probably too expensive. I am currently building a folding kayak out of 18 oz vinyl tarp and it would be more than strong enough for this application. It may be a little too thick though. 14 oz may be a better compromise between strength and flexibility. Once it is glued properly, the vinyl tears(which takes a lot) before the glue lets go. Inflatable kayaks are also being built out of the stuff and work great. It is relatively inexpensive from sites like MyTarp, which is where I got my material. Not sure of the comfort for an inflatable doll but one side is slightly smoother than the other.

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Re: Inflata companies listen to us

Post by haremlover »

From my measures of demand for inflatables, the investment in new models simply is not justified.

I mentioned that I could assist in getting Mia Isabella for UK members at much less than retail prices, without response (perhaps I'm not surprised at that lack of enthusiasm, but each to their own), and a UK doll with the Bree Olson oral face with only one expression of interest, and there is a Poupée boxed in stock for a UK forum member who wanted one but who evaporated when I told him she had arrived and was ready to send.

Demand is on the scale of mere handfuls rather than any justification of mass production. . . . save perhaps in China with the consequences of population reduction programmes.

Best wishes

Harem
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Re: Inflata companies listen to us

Post by AGL »

haremlover wrote:From my measures of demand for inflatables, the investment in new models simply is not justified.

I mentioned that I could assist in getting Mia Isabella for UK members at much less than retail prices, without response (perhaps I'm not surprised at that lack of enthusiasm, but each to their own), and a UK doll with the Bree Olson oral face with only one expression of interest, and there is a Poupée boxed in stock for a UK forum member who wanted one but who evaporated when I told him she had arrived and was ready to send.

Demand is on the scale of mere handfuls rather than any justification of mass production. . . . save perhaps in China with the consequences of population reduction programmes.

Best wishes

Harem
Yeah, but with Mia, you're speaking of a doll with, I'm sure, a very narrow range of appeal, as I don't think there are that many transsexual lovers out there that are also doll lovers.

With the other two, for most of us on here, these are dolls that have been around for quite some time & have nothing new to bring to the table. I think it would be hard to gauge interest in a new, better designed & more realistic looking inflatable using the above dolls as examples.

If a little time & money was spent to design a doll with some of the attributes that myself & others have suggested, I would think there would be much more of an interest shown.

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Re: Inflata companies listen to us

Post by haremlover »

airgirluvr wrote: With the other two, for most of us on here, these are dolls that have been around for quite some time & have nothing new to bring to the table. I think it would be hard to gauge interest in a new, better designed & more realistic looking inflatable using the above dolls as examples.

If a little time & money was spent to design a doll with some of the attributes that myself & others have suggested, I would think there would be much more of an interest shown.
Yes - points taken but what I am saying is that it is a static, not an expanding, market. As such, airgirl lovers are saturated merely replacing what is worn out or takes their fancy rather than being a straw in the wind of opinion for a healthy demand unexpressed through TDF

Best wishes

Harem
Latest reviews coming for Irontech and FJ doll silicone ladies.

Chloé's book
Image
is available from The-Doll-House
- - - -
Here's Coverdoll Yolanda
- - - -
Reviews for:
-DS-OR-JY-SY-Jarliet-Vivid-SM-SE-ZOne-JM-Sino-Sanhui-Pipedream--XY-WM-Elsa Babe-SM Silicone Siliko-XYcolo-Starpery-Elsa Babe-FutureDoll-Zelex-Irontech-FJ Doll
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Re: Inflata companies listen to us

Post by well_inflated »

I think it odd that manufacturers can't use 3D imaging software to improve their inflates. After all, 3D printers are now available, and they've been making 3D images of people to use in CGI in the movies for a while. They could then use software to alter the cast so that when inflated the proper realistic shape is regained. Of course there are problems with stress points and keeping a shape with so few seams and removing the plastic from the cast, but I'm convinced a lot better can be done than is being done at the moment.
I had a midrange inflate which was joined with the biggest seam horizontally at the belly, so they're obviously not forced to use a one-piece cast. The seams on the legs were quite good and indented. This helps dress the doll easier. I think a lot of manufacturers are just mean with the plastic. There was no excuse for the lack of hips and shape on the legs, they were just made to be thin because in those days you never got pictures of the dolls inflated.
Maybe what prevents movement in this direction is cheap Chinese copies. I don't know what is stopping them copying a good cast from the inflate, undercutting the originators and then the originator could have trouble recouping development costs.
I don't know if what I'm after is actually achievable with Vinyl, but the seamless body shapes of the latex poupees are seriously better than the vinyl I generally see.

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Re: Inflata companies listen to us

Post by nzdude »

I deleted the post because some thought it was insencitive.I deeply appoligize.

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Re: Inflata companies listen to us

Post by AGL »

nzdude wrote:I totally agree with this statement but we are in a catch 22 situation.I personally would not buy them because they are so ugly.I would not encourage anyone to buy them because they are so ugly.
I'd be careful making statements such as this, as there are many inflatable users on here, myself included, who don't feel this way & will find this statement you made as offensive. :thumbs_down:

It's like that old saying- if you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything at all.

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Re: Inflata companies listen to us

Post by yorktown »

8) Howdy

We're all different what one member feels is not worthy another thinks they've found gold - so yes as AGL points out - a bit harsh - nzdude - but i get your point in wishing for better quality and looking inflatable dolls

I actually prefer some of those value line dolls - mine favs are from the old Hong Kong company TAK SHING - they sold the line to SEVEN CREATIONS - but kept the mold work alive and have re-issued all my old favs - so for me they are not - yuk - rather i am very fond of some of them -

I do wish there was a very high end inflata-girl and would be willing to pay a premium price for a excellent quality build with stunning looks - i am not sure though that companies such as NANMA / CONBO would bother with such as they are more into the mass-production low cost - so any high quality inflata-girl would have to be made by a smaller maybe cottage industry type company

Hoping for a better future in inflata-babes - until then i just hope whats available remains so till that next leap comes - :wink:

Happy Trails - :angel:

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Re: Inflata companies listen to us

Post by nzdude »

Airgrlluvr i deleted the post because i dont want to offend anyone.The point was if each manufacturer changed from making 500 different dolls to say 30 different doll types they can concentrate on quality of those dolls instead of designing more and more.
When the quality of the airgirls change, if non doll people see them in time they may accept them and we may lose the stigma be being weird.But in my opinion not willing to upset people,as long as the very very bad looking airgirls are there they will always be on sites like rotton.com and shown as jokes in movies and television programs and the people who have them are sick.They always choose very u*** ones for most effect.They never use nice looking airgirls ??.
If the manufacturers lowered the amount of production models but concentrated on quality i think in time the airgirls (which i own myself) will get prettier and more acceptable to more people.This also should not increase the prices due to less developing etc.
This is only my opinion and i am not saying anyones airgirls are ugly (most will proberly not like mine).This is only a suggestion to manufacturers because the more people who will accept their airgirls means more sales for them and it will enhance the doll comunitee.

Ps:i replaced a word with u*** incase it offended anyone.It was not a swearword and not offensive.

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Re: Inflata companies listen to us

Post by yorktown »

8) Howdy

I thank you - nzdude - i know you were trying to push a point - it just didn't come across the way you wished - words are seen by many in different ways - not always as intended - i learned and continue to learn that leason the hard way -

I think one thing should be realized though - all companies are out to make money period - so NANMA / CONBO got started in higher end vinyl/ latex dolls and spent some money to tool up for this - but - they still had much invested actually way more in the lower end vinyl - as i like to call the value line - thats where they make there money and no they are not going to jump off that because you or me want a more quality, more realistic vinyl - sad but true

Even the higher end vinyl / latex inflates have come to a standstill - reason slower than expected sales - period
Yet the value line has grown to a virtual endless spectrum of products - great sales numbers - mean more variety

Society right now in general will not accept dolls - be they vinyl/ latex inflata-girls or silicone - the amount of money you invest will still not change - conventional concepts of doll ownership by the masses - its still not a mainstream thing - all things change - so to may this at some point in time - right now we can best hope for more quality and better looking options on our inflata-babes

I still think that any future very high quality inflata-babe will be made more by small cottage type doll maker than by some mass production factory

Happy Trails - :angel:

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Re: Inflata companies listen to us

Post by nzdude »

Thanks yorktown i have a habit of typing how i talk.I like your value line catagory and i will use value,midrange and high end inflatables.It would be nice to have more high end but this is not what i was trying to say.My first dolls were brought on the look of a box in a adult store with no real photos or access to any photos actually showing what i was buying and i was disappointed with my purchase with no comeback to return it.This stopped me from investing in any other dolls but 20 years later and the introduction of the internet and tdf i can actually find photos which the manufacturers dont want me to see or dont want published on their boxes.Because of this i am on my third airgirl.
I appreciate the dollmakers are there to make money and having a choice is great but how many value line doll choices do we need.There is a reason why manufacturers only put some photos of the actual doll on the box but i am not going to say what that is.
It is only my opinion if a manufacturer was going to design and release 400 airgirls this year,i personally would prefer they release 200 and spend the extra money they would of on the other 200 in increasing the quality of the valueline so they are happy to put the photos on the boxes and possibly increase their sales in the stores where most new doll owners will buy from.
Please please dont take this the wrong way,i am a simple guy and when i go out for dinner i want a choice of 5 to10 mains cooked well not 100 not cooked well for the same price.

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Re: Inflata companies listen to us

Post by well_inflated »

Vinyl is not expensive stuff, evidenced by how china can pump out lilos and swim rings for a handful of dollars retail. I am assuming the problem lies in development costs, know-how and don't-care, because they look on it as a minority market. Because for so long you could not get access to what these dolls looked like inflated, the manufacturers were very lazy about their quality and sold them on features like inserts and the head you could see on the more expensive boxes.
I'm not afraid to say that vinyl dolls usually look pitifully unrealistic and I attend the forum more in hope than expectation. Some dolls designed with so little care that their openings aren't even long or wide enough for a westerner, a laughably basic error which is not so funny when you pay for it.
I have seen some fairly attractive inflates recently like Feisty Faye but the usability according to @mazon.de reviews is very poor with small poorly finished openings poorly accessible due to body shape and the vinyl too thin.

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Re: Inflata companies listen to us

Post by nzdude »

Because for so long you could not get access to what these dolls looked like inflated, the manufacturers were very lazy about their quality

Well-inflated i looked at that site you refered the airgirl from and they have 193 airgirls on the site for sale.If the other manufacturer has 193 also thats 386 different choices right now just for the valueline chinese airgirls.If they manufacture airgirl number 387 many people may purchase it BUT then they will not be purchasing any of the 387 available right now.Moneywise they will be making the same but will have development costs to make up for awhile so short term they will lose money.

The chinese are clever business men and woman and they will change their businesses to supply what the paying customer wants.If some time and care was put into valueline instead of creating new dolls,in time they will be at a standard when they will be happy to put the photo of the doll on the valueline airgirl.Sure this will take awhile but it has to start somewhere.

As we all know things that were on top of the line cars only like airbags are now standard in all cars at the same price range but unless processes change in 2050 the valueline dolls will look exactly the same as they do now.Wouldn't it be great if the tera patric lookalike doll was the value range quality and manufactures were pleased to have the photos of the real doll on the cover.I do think this is achieveable but only when the manufacturers stop seeing them as money makers and actually caring for the doll communitee.

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