The Doll Forum

I'm wondering what interest there is in Phoenix making an Asian face option for the BoyToy line (please take the poll). I've seen some people say they'd buy a BT right now if a good Asian face were available. That Phoenix don't offer such an option seems indicative that they either don't believe the demand is there or don't have confidence they could do such a face "right". American manufacturers have historically (and understandably) been far better at Caucasian doll faces than Asian, with the reverse being true in terms of Asian manufacturers.

Another issue is that the BT line is somewhat stylized, which complicates the matter further because not only would Phoenix be tasked with making an attractive, widely-appealing Asian face, they'd need to make one that fits the broader BT aesthetic. Culturally, it's a bit like asking Harley-Davidson to build a Camry while maintaining a Harley "feel".

For my part, I'd love to have a good Asian face option for the BT line. The BT 3 and BT 4 models are very nearly ideal doll bodies, but those of us interested in Asian women are for now forced to look elsewhere.

Sure, I would love to see it. I am sure Matt could nail the look if he really wanted to.

blindwebster wrote:Sure, I would love to see it. I am sure Matt could nail the look if he really wanted to.

You think so? I think it's a pretty fiendish problem to cross cultures and really capture the beauty of, for example, Japanese women when you come from an American cultural background. Matt's a miracle worker, but how many miracles are we asking from the guy?

My first thought is that Phoenix would need to contract a job like this out, though the people really doing this right work for competitors like 4woods and Orient, so where you would even look to find someone like this is a challenge. There's always 3D scanning, though it's not clear that this technique is really part of what Abyss/Phoenix do even now, though the last few RD2 faces have seemed to jump significantly in realism, so either Matt is just getting better or 3D scanning has quietly crept into the process. Or maybe not so quietly, as surely the Wicked line are scanned.

I don't know, I guess I am just going off the quality of his body of work. But I do get what you are saying in terms of the Asian makers capturing the right look. I mean, they are Asian, so it is expected. That said, I do not doubt Matt's ability to create an amazing Asian face for a second. Be it scanned or whatever. Now, whether it lacks that certain authentic quality you are talking about remains to be seen.

I wish there were adaptable pieces to join asian company heads to any doll neck.

blindwebster wrote:I don't know, I guess I am just going off the quality of his body of work. But I do get what you are saying in terms of the Asian makers capturing the right look. I mean, they are Asian, so it is expected. That said, I do not doubt Matt's ability to create an amazing Asian face for a second. Be it scanned or whatever. Now, whether it lacks that certain authentic quality you are talking about remains to be seen.

Scanned, absolutely. That should sidestep issues of cultural authenticity, which are extremely subtle and difficult to quantify. People are amazingly astute when it comes to evaluating facial features. Even a single millimeter can make a big difference.

Assuming a 3D scan, at that point it becomes a matter of finding the right Asian model and accommodating any BT-specific stylization. The new Solana face, to my eyes, is the least stylized face BT have ever done, so they seem to be moving more in the direction of realism in any event. On the whole, I think you're right, that Matt and company are capable of doing this provided some American guy doesn't sit down with a lump of clay and try to knock off an Asian face. It's just a matter of making it an actual priority.

Tybalt wrote:I wish there were adaptable pieces to join asian company heads to any doll neck.

Yes, it's funny to think that, if love dolls were a mature industry, there would be standards for things like neck attachment and skin color (maybe even body proportion).

If and when we get to the point there is a gynoid/persocom/humanoid robotics industry to rival the PC industry, one imagines that such standards will quickly follow. Everyone going it alone is just too inefficient.

Sticking an Orient head on a BoyToy today though? That's a Frankenstein project...

Used to be some on boytoy japan website but they were for the interchangeable face dolls.

Sotaichou wrote:
http://realdolljapan.com/dolls_main.html
http://realdolljapan.com/pg108.html

one face




there's even anime and comixxx heads.

If you go to Stacy's sites you'll see this face featured on a bt body.

but, yes I voted Phoenix should make their own available.

/g'day.

Great find, didn't know about these! Eek, they're as atrocious as feared.

Fire up the 3D scanners, fellas, these faces aren't nearly good enough.

Yes there is a Boy Toy Japan website featuring faces! Been out for some time Stacy has had one for some years.

Sotaichou wrote:
http://realdolljapan.com/dolls_main.html
http://realdolljapan.com/pg108.html

one face




there's even anime and comixxx heads.

If you go to Stacy's sites you'll see this face featured on a bt body.

but, yes I voted Phoenix should make their own available.

/g'day.

Not too shabby. This reminds me about a discussion concerning Fay in Mirror's edge. Western men thought her Asian-ness was complete hotness, whereas Asian men tended to want a more Western look to her.



Personally, I love her purely Asian look, and I'm glad EA kept it.

deerman wrote:Yes there is a Boy Toy Japan website featuring faces! Been out for some time Stacy has had one for some years.

Okay, the RB01 face isn't atrocious, it's just not quite up to par with the best 4woods and Orient faces. The copyright says those pics are 5 years old. I'm guessing sales haven't been too great in Japan as they haven't much expanded this line.

Makes you wonder of it's possible to order an American BoyToy with this head, or order this head from the Japan store for use with an American BT. Is it even compatible with a model like the BT3 / BT4? So many questions...