We can rebuild her. New MF hand plates and wires.

[matt gloss]

[MannequinFan]

Can you send me the model for the hand plate? I want to machine a couple of them out of aluminum. Can I pm my email to you?

Hi Madd,
I'll post the print files after Panther has a chance to test out this current design.
Just don't want anyone tearing into their dolls and installing stuff that hasn't been thoroughly tested first.

The design I've done is specifically intended for 3d printing with plastic, so you may want to do them a little differently anyway for machined metal.
With these current improvements I honestly don't think metal plates will be needed.
Not sure what the costs are with machining, but at 4 cents/gram the material cost of these plates is less than a dollar a pair.

[algaeholics]

...but at 4 cents/gram the material cost of these plates is...

Your paying $40 for 1kg filament? I'd look elsewhere sir, it seems a bit steep!

[maddmatter70]

Can you send me the model for the hand plate? I want to machine a couple of them out of aluminum. Can I pm my email to you?

Hi Madd,
I'll post the print files after Panther has a chance to test out this current design.
Just don't want anyone tearing into their dolls and installing stuff that hasn't been thoroughly tested first.

The design I've done is specifically intended for 3d printing with plastic, so you may want to do them a little differently anyway for machined metal.
With these current improvements I honestly don't think metal plates will be needed.
Not sure what the costs are with machining, but at 4 cents/gram the material cost of these plates is less than a dollar a pair.

I have access to machine tools and a 3d printer. I have more access to cnc equipment, if I can see the model, hopefully a .stp file, I can manipulate it to better suit my needs. Basicly I just need the spacing and outer dimensions. But I would like to try the 3d printer too!

[MannequinFan]

...but at 4 cents/gram the material cost of these plates is...

Your paying $40 for 1kg filament? I'd look elsewhere sir, it seems a bit steep!

That's for the premium Tiertime ABS filament which is a stronger higher temp ABS (260c-270c).
I just wanted to use a high end figure for the estimate.
The regular stuff I use is more like $22/kg...
https://www.paramount-3d.com/abs

[Tyr]

Good work guys,
I have been intermittently pursuing a similar solution but with differences. Maybe my ideas will help.

P7170292.JPG (812.65 KiB) Viewed 1467 times

I am using a 2 piece palm plate, 1.75mm White rigid ink PLA it's strong AF.
I am using brass pcb standoffs and grub screws to hold the wires in place.
on the wires I am using heat shrink to hold the assembly together. starting with this wire,

P7170299.JPG (783.38 KiB) Viewed 1467 times

First I tin the ends, then strip the insulation off as it is too big to fit inside the brass tubes. After it has been stripped, I reinforce the joint areas with heat shrink tube from this kit,

P7170297.JPG (801.78 KiB) Viewed 1467 times

then feed on the appropriate tubes and shroud the whole lot in clear heat shrink tube. I'm hoping that it will help with the insertion of the wires.

P7170296.JPG (794.46 KiB) Viewed 1467 times

I plan to fit some printed fingertips to go on the end of the wires.

I do have some concerns however, I'm not that confident that it will be possible to insert the wires into a dolls fingers. I have a 16swg music wire probe that I tried in one of Ami's fingers and it wasn't easy to push it in as far as the palm plate. I think that even with lube, it will be very difficult to insert these types of finger wires. Ami has finger pokes in every finger so my plan was to insert these from the finger tip, compressing the finger as opposed to stretching the finger, just in case of a slip up! has anybody tried a tube clad wire yet, if so how did it go?

Tyr

[MannequinFan]

Hi Tyr,

Panther had no problems with the plate size or inserting the finger wires in his doll.



This was with the 5/32" (4mm) diam. tubing (no shrink tube).
The big issue was with the strength of the plastic at the wrist connection when using the hands as a lever to rotate the wrists. This failed on the first test. The killer is the sideways pressure on the connection.
This is why we went with a steel eye bolt for the wrist connection.

I'm not sure that what you are showing will survive that test. Have you tried it?

BTW, for adhering the tubing I'm using a silicone adhesive which is flexible and allows the tubing to be pulled off and reused on a new wire. The silicone adhesive won't hurt TPE.

[Tyr]

Hi MF, Glad it worked out for Panther I haven't tried a sideways pull test but I will. I saw the eyebolt idea and can easily adapt mine to suit. I will give mine a tug though as it seems incredibly strong! It's all subjective I suppose. I have some permatex on order but it seems to have disappeared in the Christmas post.

Tyr

[MannequinFan]

I thought my original plate was plenty strong as well. Apparently with a tight wrist joint there can be an immense amount of leverage applied. I think part of the problem also is that the fork in the wrist joint is pretty small so it puts a lot of concentrated pressure on the end of the plastic part when bent sideways.

Regarding the wire attachment, it's important that both the tubes and wire are solidly attached to the palm plate.
The metacarpals need to be rigid like in a real hand so you don't want those tubes to move.

What I've got now I think is working really well and it's super simple. The pointed sheet metal screws drive down into the wire through holes in the tubes which holds them both rock solid to the palm plate.
This cutaway should help illustrate (wire not shown)...

[Panther68]

Wow, quite the chain of responses over the last 24 hours.

MF is correct, the weakness is at the base. One must use the plate as a lever to rotate the wrists. I would say Anastasia's wrist joint is not overly tight compared to my 9 other dolls, so a hand plate would need to handle the torque for wrist rotation.

It survived the first day, but as I continued testing the following day, it failed at the base.

Also, of note, one can see wear on the plastic where the bolt goes through the plate. This, more than likely would have lead to failure after short time. So, sometime type of metal at the wrist joint is a must as plastic will just not tolerate the friction and torque at the joint.

IMG_0013.JPG (419.71 KiB) Viewed 1446 times

As for the wires, I was surprised how easily the wires went into her TPE fingers. The openings for the wires to be fed through were quite easy see within her palms. Had no issue with any fingers or thumb. There may be an issue with the TPE fingers wanting to rotate on the wire as the factory wires are wrapped with string to prevent this. This is only a slight inconvenience as one can easily just rotate back to proper position.

Anastasia saying "Hi" to everyone, though I am getting a bit concerned. She is really liking to drink those little liquor bottles.

[ildanach]

Indeed, good luck! I'm extremely curious about how this works out and if it's more durable than the factory fingers over time. Can't wait to hear/see how it goes! Thanks for posting this

I feel exactly the same. One of my dolls is in dire need and this is the route I am planning on taking.

And here is another one with the same feeling. I've allways disliked ( to say it more friendly) the fingerwires which go in every direction but the good one and this initiative is the one I've been looking for, for a long time.
So I really hope this will succeed !!

[Panther68]

Indeed, good luck! I'm extremely curious about how this works out and if it's more durable than the factory fingers over time. Can't wait to hear/see how it goes! Thanks for posting this

I feel exactly the same. One of my dolls is in dire need and this is the route I am planning on taking.

And here is another one with the same feeling. I've allways disliked ( to say it more friendly) the fingerwires which go in every direction but the good one and this initiative is the one I've been looking for, for a long time.
So I really hope this will succeed !!

I completely agree with you. Many have complained about this. Some have offered suggestions. Crazy Cajun did have a solution with his hand plates, but when he passed away, no one picked up the baton to continue it. Not too many metal workers on the forum. MF is very determined to solve this problem with his 3D printer and typical hardware(screw, eyebolts) to make this easy to produce for the masses. I am very confident he will find a solution. I will do my best to properly test his prototype to ensure its quality and durability.

[ildanach]

I completely agree with you. Many have complained about this. Some have offered suggestions. Crazy Cajun did have a solution with his hand plates, but when he passed away, no one picked up the baton to continue it. Not too many metal workers on the forum. MF is very determined to solve this problem with his 3D printer and typical hardware(screw, eyebolts) to make this easy to produce for the masses. I am very confident he will find a solution. I will do my best to properly test his prototype to ensure its quality and durability.

And thinking more towards the future now, the other thing I dislike are the toes. I'm sure I'm not the only one who sometimes likes to grab to the toes of our loved ones ( Human or TPE Doll) and when one grabs something which feels just like jellly with a nail on it ... well, it distracts .
So I'm also thinking of changing that some time in the future too.

[Metacog]

Indeed, good luck! I'm extremely curious about how this works out and if it's more durable than the factory fingers over time. Can't wait to hear/see how it goes! Thanks for posting this

I feel exactly the same. One of my dolls is in dire need and this is the route I am planning on taking.

And here is another one with the same feeling. I've allways disliked ( to say it more friendly) the fingerwires which go in every direction but the good one and this initiative is the one I've been looking for, for a long time.
So I really hope this will succeed !!

I completely agree with you. Many have complained about this. Some have offered suggestions. Crazy Cajun did have a solution with his hand plates, but when he passed away, no one picked up the baton to continue it. Not too many metal workers on the forum. MF is very determined to solve this problem with his 3D printer and typical hardware(screw, eyebolts) to make this easy to produce for the masses. I am very confident he will find a solution. I will do my best to properly test his prototype to ensure its quality and durability.

Jumping on the band wagon for new wrists for my Brie. Unfortunately, perhaps, she is a PIB 120cm doll and I don't see how MF's solution would work in Brie. Instead of gloves I put an Ace bandage on her... not the best, but at least the wires don't come through and stab her or me. The forearm seems to be a solid piece of hard plastic that goes all the way to her elbow. The wrist itself was held by just an orange grommet-thingy (see image), which has split (I didn't do that; the multiple, twisting finger wires, apparently). I will jury-rig MF's final solution if I have to since Brie's internal wrist is completely detached (oh the pain!).

Yup, if MF could open up a shop with a gadzillion staff for EME eyes, wrists, (feet! eventually)..... we love you, man! (brotherly love).

[MannequinFan]

Thanks Metacog, I really appreciate the compliments.

For a PIB, you'd need to have a clevis type joint in the wrist.
https://www.mcmaster.com/6071k41


The other problem would be the hand size on a 120cm doll.
The design I have is for bigger dolls with a hand size of approx. 6" to 6-1/2" from wrist joint to tip of middle finger. You could probably size it down some but not sure if it would work.