Making my attempt at hand plates

[grimreefer24601]

Sorry WWB. I was really just poking you about your comment to MF. That you can make them in a couple of hours. I think I poked to far though. I apologize.

I know you've put a lot of work into these. I also know they're not easy to make. And nobody's got any time to spare.

I hope you get to a point where you can offer these hand plates. Hell, if your interested we could see if we can get them added to a Jinsan skeleton. Only need to order 1000.

Again, I took your comment wrong. I was an ass. I apologize.
Grim

[winterwarBo]

You know I would gladly give you the other set I have that I didn't finish drilling and tapping. I trashed my drill bits and taps making the ones in Lisa. I should have gotten cobalt bits. I will not use stainless steel in the future. I love it but it's a royal bitch to work with.

I like MF idea of the two halves, I like the magnet idea, they are all good. 3D printed parts can be extremely durable if normalised. I have considered getting a 3D printer. I will say that plastic would NOT hold up to Lisa's stiff wrist rotation.

The NWdoll doesn't have a wrist like Jinsan. The wires come out of the wrist through the palm. It's weird, you lose wrist and hand rotation, but the wires I would think wouldn't be as prone to breakage since they aren't in a high stress area.

Quinn being a Rifrano uses flat wires for her finger. I like this but they arent ridget enough to hold much of anything. Flat metal banding would be something interesting to try since I haven't seen anyone try that yet.

[MannequinFan]

I will say that plastic would NOT hold up to Lisa's stiff wrist rotation.

ABS is very strong if printed in the correct orientation. It will bend before it breaks.
You'd just need to make sure you use the palm to bend her wrist, not the fingers.
I'm just thinking of cost here. Machined plates are going to be very expensive for others wanting to do this.

After working up the prototype I'm 99.9% certain the printed ones will work just fine, but they need to be done the way I've suggested, not some other way or with some other material.
My problem is that I don't have an old doll that needs a hand job ( ) so I can't do an installation to prove it.

WWB I'll send you some printed plates for free if you're willing to give them a shot the way I've designed them, or at least give an assessment.

[grimreefer24601]

Part of the wire would still be in a high stress area. Any wire I bend back and forth will break eventually.

Fingers are going to break. They need to be replaceable without major surgery and steel cutting tools.

It's my same opinion on the goose neck. If it breaks I can't repair it easily. A hinged neck can be repaired much easier.

Flat wires would work for some joints, but I wouldn't think they'd allow any side to side motion. I don't think it would stop breaking.

I like MF's idea about using copper tubes for articulation, but I'm not sure how one would actually install them.

[MannequinFan]

I like MF's idea about using copper tubes for articulation, but I'm not sure how one would actually install them.

Grim I was trying to think along the same lines that CC did in his installation video.
The finger wires would be all be made up with the tubes on them and inserted into the fingers.
I just put a little epoxy on the wires and slid the tubes on spinning them a little to spread it evenly. It's pretty easy to do.

With the palm plate in place, the first tube on the fingers are super glued into the slots in the palm plate to hold them in place while you work. The slots are splayed to allow for different knuckle spacings.
With all the fingers placed the cover is then screwed on with epoxy to fill the voids and make for a solid assembly.
I went through this with the prototype and it worked fine.

[winterwarBo]

MF I am flattered for offering me your hand plates but the only doll I have left with issues is Kat. But she only has one broken finger. I thought she was worse than that but I left her hands in a fist for so long I forgot that she wasn't that bad. Not bad enough to make me want to cut her apart. She needs her legs tightened up first before I would want to do her hands.

Janie and Lisa were beyond bad. Lisa her hands flopped in the breeze. I got her with broken hands in July off someone in the group that was VERY local to me. Both Janie and her were made within a couple weeks of each other in Late 2016. The year and a half Lisa spent with her original owner in Forced air heating dried out some of her pretty good. Lisa is my test patient for the others. I don't have forced air heat I have radiators my girls are lightly oiled after cleaning but are in great shape. Lisa is not exactly brittle but she is. I never seen this before and didn't notice this until I was doing the surgery on her. After I cleaned her I did oil her up and hit some areas with vasoline to at least try to slow down what had already started.

Grim her flat wires are really thin posablity isn't a problem. You saw Quinn for yourself. She can pass off a decent doll any day of the week.

IMG_1665.PNG (10 MiB) Viewed 538 times

[Broven]

I can't even express how much I want this to be a thing!

The tubes sound like a perfect idea. Fingers that only bend at the joints.... I volunteer!

Are you looking for volunteers..?

[winterwarBo]

I can't even express how much I want this to be a thing!

The tubes sound like a perfect idea. Fingers that only bend at the joints.... I volunteer!

Are you looking for volunteers..?

Anne marie needs this!!

[grimreefer24601]

Quinn is amazing. You'd never know she's a Rifrano. Makes me wonder if they're really that bad.

@Broven, you gonna put these on the new body or the old one?

And seriously I did check with Jinsan skeleton changes are a MOQ of 1000.

[winterwarBo]

Quinn is amazing. You'd never know she's a Rifrano. Makes me wonder if they're really that bad.

@Broven, you gonna put these on the new body or the old one?

And seriously I did check with Jinsan skeleton changes are a MOQ of 1000.

If I end up going to China I will visit Jinsan and tell them what mistakes they are making and how to improve on quality issues.

I like the tubes my issue is with the joints. Maybe use tubes over THHN wire with the insulation still on it. That would be crazy strong and THHN is pretty robust.

[grimreefer24601]

Those print files look interesting MF. I'll see what I can do to try them out.

WWB: I think they will have to address this situation. I'd like to push a hand plate to Jinsan. We'd never make anything on it. Just to get them to add it. I've got a pair of CC's originals. Never installed.

Should I offer them to Jinsan in order to improve dolls in general?

Grim

[winterwarBo]

Those print files look interesting MF. I'll see what I can do to try them out.

WWB: I think they will have to address this situation. I'd like to push a hand plate to Jinsan. We'd never make anything on it. Just to get them to add it. I've got a pair of CC's originals. Never installed.

Should I offer them to Jinsan in order to improve dolls in general?

Grim

Shit I would be happy if they just stopped welding the Heads of the machine screws.. That pisses me off more than anything else.

[grimreefer24601]

Me too!

[Broven]

@Broven, you gonna put these on the new body or the old one?

The old one. Now that I (almost) have two dolls, Anna Marie's old body will be a little bit of a test bed for me to try repairs, etc on.
But, if it works, I'd do both bodies eventually. The current hands drive me a little nuts.

[MannequinFan]

I can't even express how much I want this to be a thing!

The tubes sound like a perfect idea. Fingers that only bend at the joints.... I volunteer!

Are you looking for volunteers..?

I'd be happy to send you plates if you want to try it, but do you really want to cut into your doll?
I'm also not sure of how many different wrist connections there are so that would need to be verified.
The prototype I made is for the 8mm bolt connection like in the CC video.

I like the tubes my issue is with the joints. Maybe use tubes over THHN wire with the insulation still on it. That would be crazy strong and THHN is pretty robust.

I used THHN/THWN 14 GA stranded in my prototype with insulation on fits perfectly in the 5/32" brass tubing. I don't see it breaking anytime soon.
The insulation also helps the joints bend with more of a smooth arc which should also help longevity.
This is the stuff. Home Depot sells it by the foot.
https://www.cerrowire.com/wp-content/up ... s_2014.pdf