Very STRONG WARNING not to buy ebay, alibaba or aliexpress

[doolloovr]

To speak about my case, it seems that whenever a dispute is opened, there is an Aliexpress judgement comitee that will look at your problem, so for me, I checked 2 out of 3 items of decision : beyond time delivery and doll partly defect that entitled me to a 66% theoretical discount on paid price . Overall, I suppose I should feel satisfied

[Aliel The Heretic]

I've been told not to buy entire dolls on Alibaba/AliExpress due to scam sellers sending cheap blow up dolls instead of TPE/Silicone.

[Aliel The Heretic]

Have you checked the sellers on amazon.com? Thank you btw for seeing who are frauds and who are not.

I'm currently reviewing the AILIJIA store on Amazon for a custom Monster/Fantasy Mini Doll.

Once I know for sure I'll be making a recommendation in the Monster Girl / Review sections of the forum.

[haremlover]

Ha Ha! Good luck!

Best wishes

Harem

[VSP]

I agree Alibaba can be a dangerous hunting ground but if you know what you're looking for and know what to ask you can find the real deal for hundreds below retail (sometimes even hundreds below wholesale).

Here's an example: I always engage the salesperson with specific questions about whether the doll is genuine or a copy. Now with Trade Assurance they are much more careful about how they answer. Keep in mind Trade Assurance puts the cost of return shipping on the buyer so it's still not 100% safe. I exchanged emails with a company that swears they are the factory for 6Ye. When I contacted 6Ye they said they did not sell dolls on AliBaba, but here's the thing: this company turned out to be truthful. I ended up ordering a doll with the understanding that it needed to be genuine; headstamp, ball & socket joints, etc. (6Ye is a good test for this sort of thing because of the stamp and joint differences). I received the doll and sure enough, it's authentic. Bad news for 6Ye and its resellers. This doll retails for over $2000 , I paid less than $900.

WM and JY are also available under the same circumstances.

[Slew]

I agree Alibaba can be a dangerous hunting ground but if you know what you're looking for and know what to ask you can find the real deal for hundreds below retail (sometimes even hundreds below wholesale).

Here's an example: I always engage the salesperson with specific questions about whether the doll is genuine or a copy. Now with Trade Assurance they are much more careful about how they answer. Keep in mind Trade Assurance puts the cost of return shipping on the buyer so it's still not 100% safe. I exchanged emails with a company that swears they are the factory for 6Ye. When I contacted 6Ye they said they did not sell dolls on AliBaba, but here's the thing: this company turned out to be truthful. I ended up ordering a doll with the understanding that it needed to be genuine; headstamp, ball & socket joints, etc. (6Ye is a good test for this sort of thing because of the stamp and joint differences). I received the doll and sure enough, it's authentic. Bad news for 6Ye and its resellers. This doll retails for over $2000 , I paid less than $900.

WM and JY are also available under the same circumstances.

The only thing I take away from this is that someone is lying. Either 6Ye is letting unauthorized parties gain access to their factory molds and skeletons, or some fraudulent party is making very highly detailed replicas using similar parts and copying the head stamp.

It's great to be a shrewd shopper and find good deals, but the bottom line is if you support these ultra cheap-priced sellers, you're supporting the black market and hurting the legitimate market.

[Boobman]

I agree Alibaba can be a dangerous hunting ground but if you know what you're looking for and know what to ask you can find the real deal for hundreds below retail (sometimes even hundreds below wholesale).

Here's an example: I always engage the salesperson with specific questions about whether the doll is genuine or a copy. Now with Trade Assurance they are much more careful about how they answer. Keep in mind Trade Assurance puts the cost of return shipping on the buyer so it's still not 100% safe. I exchanged emails with a company that swears they are the factory for 6Ye. When I contacted 6Ye they said they did not sell dolls on AliBaba, but here's the thing: this company turned out to be truthful. I ended up ordering a doll with the understanding that it needed to be genuine; headstamp, ball & socket joints, etc. (6Ye is a good test for this sort of thing because of the stamp and joint differences). I received the doll and sure enough, it's authentic. Bad news for 6Ye and its resellers. This doll retails for over $2000 , I paid less than $900.

WM and JY are also available under the same circumstances.

The only thing I take away from this is that someone is lying. Either 6Ye is letting unauthorized parties gain access to their factory molds and skeletons, or some fraudulent party is making very highly detailed replicas using similar parts and copying the head stamp.

It's great to be a shrewd shopper and find good deals, but the bottom line is if you support these ultra cheap-priced sellers, you're supporting the black market and hurting the legitimate market.

Also this Trade Assurance with Ali in my case did not mean jack shit. PayPal sided with me & i got my money back, Ali said FU essentially & banned me from leaving responses or even letting me access much of the site etc. The case was for my original Vanellope which i did not even get nothing & then stall, stall, & stall some more till time is the end or you give up. I cannot state it any clearer you are risking your money yes but the more they can steal others property in many forms beyond cash & then they sell even more of the same like Slew said.

[VSP]

I agree Alibaba can be a dangerous hunting ground but if you know what you're looking for and know what to ask you can find the real deal for hundreds below retail (sometimes even hundreds below wholesale).

Here's an example: I always engage the salesperson with specific questions about whether the doll is genuine or a copy. Now with Trade Assurance they are much more careful about how they answer. Keep in mind Trade Assurance puts the cost of return shipping on the buyer so it's still not 100% safe. I exchanged emails with a company that swears they are the factory for 6Ye. When I contacted 6Ye they said they did not sell dolls on AliBaba, but here's the thing: this company turned out to be truthful. I ended up ordering a doll with the understanding that it needed to be genuine; headstamp, ball & socket joints, etc. (6Ye is a good test for this sort of thing because of the stamp and joint differences). I received the doll and sure enough, it's authentic. Bad news for 6Ye and its resellers. This doll retails for over $2000 , I paid less than $900.

WM and JY are also available under the same circumstances.

The only thing I take away from this is that someone is lying. Either 6Ye is letting unauthorized parties gain access to their factory molds and skeletons, or some fraudulent party is making very highly detailed replicas using similar parts and copying the head stamp.

It's great to be a shrewd shopper and find good deals, but the bottom line is if you support these ultra cheap-priced sellers, you're supporting the black market and hurting the legitimate market.

The doll is definitely legit, it's far too detailed and carefully constructed to be a cheap copy... but I hear what you're saying about the black market. However, my experience with this purchases has me believing the manufacturer/brand are willing participants in these sales.

[VSP]

Additionally, I live in Los Angeles and frequent the garment district to buy fabric from wholesalers (sometimes at below wholesale). They're not black marketeers, and neither is the seller I buy from on AliBaba (who I won't mention here). This seller is very closely associated with WM. That's not to say there aren't cheats on AliBaba--there's a bunch of them! You just have to be careful who you buy from.

[haremlover]

It's a characteristic of Chinese peasant business culture that if someone somewhere can see a cheap buck to be made, then the bird in hand rather than two in the bush business will triumph. Perhaps run by bean-counters a factory might over-produce possibly to keep volume of production up to keep employees in business. But with the cheap buck there can be a disadvantage which is not immediately apparent.

The peasant business mentality has a system of justice all of its own. I knew an Italian young lad whose Uncle produced olive oil. It was very good olive oil and a German wanted to buy a barrel. But the German insisted on buying and collecting it at 6 o'clock in the morning, clearly on the start of his travels back home. The Italian didn't like having to get up at 6 o'clock in the morning and so filled the barrel up at least two thirds with water and only a third olive oil which floated on top with the water imperceptibly beneath.

If the business is run by bean-counters then the bean-counters will certainly not let full quality products to be produced to be sold at bean-counting prices.

Like some others on the forum I'm quite close to the circle of manufacturers some of whom I count as friends and with whom we communicate socially from time to time. Like others on the forum through this means sometimes I pick up on gossip among them, and sometimes I don't. So there will be others here who have good reason from behind the scenes to give advice one way or the other and those people are worth taking notice of.

One of the doll manufacturers who I know as a friend used to work in the mannequin industry. She imported a container of mannequins into the USA but the batch was produced under the eye of the son of the factory owner. The factory owner was a genius but a drunkard, whose habit created chaos down the line and who I can safely say is not in the picture any more in the doll industry, and relied on his son to oversee production in the family. But the son was a gaming addict. When the container arrived the contents were found to be rubbish quality and my friend was some $30,000 down. That was mannequins.

Job lots of reject dolls are also sold. Where do you think they're marketed? Not by TDF approved vendors . . . .

Best wishes

Harem

[dbenzguy]

Have you checked the sellers on amazon.com? Thank you btw for seeing who are frauds and who are not.

I'm currently reviewing the AILIJIA store on Amazon for a custom Monster/Fantasy Mini Doll.

Once I know for sure I'll be making a recommendation in the Monster Girl / Review sections of the forum.

Hi,

I bought my first doll from AILIJIA and have been very happy with it... it's not perfect (none of them are) and the joints loosened up fairly quick but I believe much of this was due to me being a noob and not knowing how to manage dolls.

I wouldn't hesitate to buy from them again. They handled everything very professionally.

[haremlover]

Thanks for actually naming that store - it's very helpful. Advice - AVOID LIKE THE PLAGUE

The reason for this is that there are many dolls around the £500 mark INCLUDING SHIPPING which puts the doll at around the £250 mark without profits. These must be fake. No question about it. Thanks to one of my friend manufacturers I know the factory door price of genuine WM dolls and THIS PRICE LEVEL SIMPLY IS NOT POSSIBLE.

Many of the dolls are featured by photos taken by Mandos and in effect steal his work so as to promote non-genuine dolls and they are not genuine.

"Haha" you say - "but they are!" But they're not. The photo for instance of the iconic WM Nava doll https://www.the-doll-house.com/nava-168 ... on-uk.html

is a 168 high doll retailing at £1500.

£558 for that doll just isn't possible . . . and you don't get the doll shown in the photo. The specifications for that doll from Aliexpress don't give it a WM reference at all, but their own AYJ-155-88 for a good reason - you're only going to get a 155 high doll instead of the lanky sexy 168 figure photographed.

In contrast another iconic doll, the Climax 175 is labelled a 176 at the special price of £443. Great. Unlike the other one, shipping to UK is £637, a total of over £1000. Climax dolls are generally not cheaper than WM dolls. So the mathematics of the economic model of this Ali seller is madness in every way and they are not to be trusted an inch.

Just don't give these sellers mind-room. The photos are false and seductive and you won't be able to resist this or that at some stage . . . and the result will be that both for peace of mind and end result alike you'll be rather better going to a reputable vendor.

Best wishes

Harem

[SaraHayes]

Thanks for actually naming that store - it's very helpful. Advice - AVOID LIKE THE PLAGUE

The reason for this is that there are many dolls around the £500 mark INCLUDING SHIPPING which puts the doll at around the £250 mark without profits. These must be fake. No question about it. Thanks to one of my friend manufacturers I know the factory door price of genuine WM dolls and THIS PRICE LEVEL SIMPLY IS NOT POSSIBLE.

Many of the dolls are featured by photos taken by Mandos and in effect steal his work so as to promote non-genuine dolls and they are not genuine.

"Haha" you say - "but they are!" But they're not. The photo for instance of the iconic WM Nava doll https://www.the-doll-house.com/nava-168 ... on-uk.html

is a 168 high doll retailing at £1500.

£558 for that doll just isn't possible . . . and you don't get the doll shown in the photo. The specifications for that doll from Aliexpress don't give it a WM reference at all, but their own AYJ-155-88 for a good reason - you're only going to get a 155 high doll instead of the lanky sexy 168 figure photographed.

In contrast another iconic doll, the Climax 175 is labelled a 176 at the special price of £443. Great. Unlike the other one, shipping to UK is £637, a total of over £1000. Climax dolls are generally not cheaper than WM dolls. So the mathematics of the economic model of this Ali seller is madness in every way and they are not to be trusted an inch.

Just don't give these sellers mind-room. The photos are false and seductive and you won't be able to resist this or that at some stage . . . and the result will be that both for peace of mind and end result alike you'll be rather better going to a reputable vendor.

Best wishes

Harem

how much more different are the fake dolls? if your getting a fake doll for $1,500 cheaper then isnt it better for some people? i got a cheap doll as my first one which i now realize is a fake knock off but for the price it lasted. i do want to get a official one but seeing dolls that are fake for $500 and the same one at 2000$ is a big jump when im not picky about small details. btu since i never owned a official one yet i cannot compare fake to official accurately. i only know my fake doll isnt that bad.

[haremlover]

Well the answer is that having tested dolls for manufacturers some bad dolls are very very bad indeed.

Even new manufacturers can have flaws which need correcting. Often factories turn out widgets for the sake of turning out widgets just as in Orwell's 1984 the measure of success of the economy is how many shoelaces are being produced, whether or not anyone needs them. So a factory making dolls just to make widgets to make money turns out a doll without care in manufacture, design or function.

I had a doll from a new manufacturer well self-championed. The legs did not move at a large enough angle for sex, the private parts were placed so that no male could use them and the TPE started falling to pieces. Factories don't have in-house doll testers so they manufacture blind as to function. This particular manufacturer wasn't happy about my lack of published review and lack of a great number of sexy photos and was very upset to hear that I'd given the doll away. But I could not recommend it as it was. But the manufacturer has improved as a result of my observations and has now quite a following. Fake manufacturers have not gone through that process.

I had another two dolls from another manufacturer, the TPE quality of which was terrible. I gave the first away to a friend and she fell to pieces in two months. The second was better to the point I could sell for the cost of the shipping only. The third was superb but upon testing in bed broke her hip on me with normal movements. That manufacturer didn't talk to me again and faded into the background.

If you buy from a known manufacturer who regards their reputation, and especially TDF affiliated, then if you get a doll that has a serious problem the manufacturer will have an interest in keeping you happy. One example of this is a new silicone manufacturer and someone was brave enough to buy the first doll. It was terrible but through TDF reputation preservation pressures some sort of agreement was made with the customer to have kept him happy enough. Often dispute resolution measures aren't revealed publicly but it's in cases such as these where buying a known quality doll can save heartache and a torn pocket.

Best wishes

Harem

[dbenzguy]

how much more different are the fake dolls? if your getting a fake doll for $1,500 cheaper then isnt it better for some people? i got a cheap doll as my first one which i now realize is a fake knock off but for the price it lasted. i do want to get a official one but seeing dolls that are fake for $500 and the same one at 2000$ is a big jump when im not picky about small details. btu since i never owned a official one yet i cannot compare fake to official accurately. i only know my fake doll isnt that bad.

Dolls are like anything else... you tend to get what you pay for. In my experience, the cheap dolls aren't fake or knock-offs... they are just cheap dolls with questionable advertising.

The bodies and faces seem to be much less detailed and aren't finished as nicely as the name brand rivals. The blemishes are more apparent, the makeup is incredibly basic and they don't take the time to check the skeletons for joint consistency and such. I haven't noticed much difference in the TPE but I do notice cheaper structure in the hands and feet.

That said, sometimes cheap is ok... I just wish that these companies would use accurate pictures of their products instead of stealing others. If they were more honest about what they sold, it would make everything better. Don't show pictures of a Mercedes when you're selling a Chevy!

IMO the name brand dolls are much better if you're really into the hobby, you want to use them for photography or you intend to really put some mileage on the doll. The cheap dolls just won't look as good and won't typically hold up as well.